So we have said all along “Jump in! Join us! Catch Up!” anywhere in this study. Now that I’ve read this chapter, I’d have to say this would not be the one to start with. While still good and informative, I think you need the background of at least the intros to put it into context.
I was really squirmy through the first part stating that sex should be uncomfortable. Ok Hal, I know you’re trying to be quippy with words and all but this is a little over the border for me. There’s just too much sexual dysfunction in the world and I don’t want anyone to get the wrong idea. But then again, I’m speaking from my past and upbringing. I’m the girl who’s mother described sex as “painful but you want it to hurt a little.” Um yeah. Was that a trick to get me to NOT have sex? And I do not even want to think about why my parents sex is painful for my mom. Ugh! Too much.
So, I got off on a great foot with my personal confidence in the sexual intimacy category. Through in the catholic good girl syndrome and it’s taken me nearly a full 40 years to realize that
JESUS WANTS US TO HAVE FREAKY GREAT SEX WITH OUR HUSBANDS!!!
(That’s one of my personal favorite marriage lines to really get people to pay attention!)
Now I have had some very healing and restorative conversations with some fire wives about sex. Like many of you, I went through my entire first marriage rarely experiencing an orgasm. Of course, there was zero emotional communication so it all makes sense. They are so interwoven as Hal so accurately shares as well.
So let me get a little raw and revealing here. Control freak girl (that’s me) needs to lose a little bit of that control (in the bedroom) to let someone please her. This did not happen for me until I met a man (my current husband, duh!) who
– is so strong in the verbal affirmation love language I can’t even keep up with him
– came with a confident swagger that made me feel safe and secure with him “in charge” as head of our household (this is where I get a bit mixed up with Hal’s message by the way. I want to feel safe and secure…..but authentically, not because we are stuffing the tough stuff and not dealing with it.)
– who I felt so at ease with that I could actually relax and let him pleasure me, yes to finally experience regular orgasms
and the older I get (ahem, 40 year old sex drive in women is no joke and I can understand why some ladies don’t mind being called cougars!!) it seems that we are also trying new things. So yes that is a little daring and adding the unexpected, outside the safe zone.
But…..I truly believe that also comes because of how much personal and emotional growth we’ve had in our marriage. Let’s face it. When he is irritable and you are feeling hopeless, throwing your arm over his back and spooning in bed is a last ditch effort to try to connect. If he responds, it patches the bad spot for a moment and maybe encourages him as a man to open up a bit in what I like to call “the golden moment”. After you’ve had great sex and can say almost anything without him getting mad.
“That was so wonderful.” *sigh* quietness. stillness. “I was so mad at you today when you ____________. And now that’s all just washed away.”
And he responds something like “yeah I need to get better about that.” and you both laugh it away.
The golden moment of forgiveness before you slip into the sex exhaustion coma.
Well, now I didn’t intend to just dump our sex life like that but there you go! Why bother erasing? I hope this is helpful to some of you.
Back to the book, the most insightful quotes for me were:
Page 188 “By remaining calm and present when your spouse chooses to respond, you create the opportunity for an authentic self-representation from your partner.”
Page 183 “Each partner is waiting for the other to make the bold, risky, vulnerable first move.” So true! So many ladies ask me “Why do I have to be the one to go first? To apologize first? To break the silence and approach him?” I truly believe its because someone has to and if you do it enough times (with calmness and maturity) you’ll be setting such an amazing example for your spouse as to how easy it is. Eventually (it took 6 years for me so be patient!) the silent treatments get shorter and he’ll surprise you by breaking them first.
Page 177 “The knowledge we both reveal and gain about ourselves and the other during sex is more revealing than any other kind of knowledge.” This is exactly why women get defensive and possessive when other women “touch” their husbands. Even those ladies who casually lay their hands on his arm while they talk to him. Yeah. Not going to happen around me. it’s totally crossing a line because immediately the conversation is more intimate with the touch. However, I’m not sure I buy that sexual knowledge is more revealing than any other kind. of course, I haven’t studied it for years to know for sure but it seems that knowledge of their hearts and dreams and fears and how their brains work should be so much more revealing than how they have sex. Maybe they just have a sex hang up from some childhood upbringing like me. This is a good one to chat about in the comments.
Everything you need to become naked and unashamed with your spouse is already available to you. p.182
Experiencing an erotic, emotional connection as you’ve never had before is going to require some intentional moves and responses you’ve never tried before. p.189
A few questions to discuss in the comments….answer as openly or discretely as you prefer
1. Who usually initiates sex and how? Next time what I want to happen is…….
2. What do you think about the statement: “great sex is supposed to be uncomfortable. What are some areas of your sex life that you need to take a risk?
3. Are there some habits you would like to get rid of?
4. What are some of the biggest issues in your sex life? How have you tried to work on those or have you tried to talk to your partner about them?
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I feel the same way as Lori. I had to read this chapter over and over (and still will). When it comes to the “great sex is supposed to be uncomfortable” and “safe and secure” statements especially. I was abused at 15 years old by an uncle (not sex but enough to consider it abuse) and do not have a great relationship with my father so I searched for love growing up in all the wrong places. Thank God that he was always with me and led me to my husband. Then, it hit me this morning (even though I was pretty sure what Hal meant) what this means. Sex is more about the actual act of sex. It’s about the events leading up to sex as well. So, I kid you not, this happened last night. We rarely ever have middle of the night sex. We are just too tired. BUT, my husband has always told me to wake him up anytime (of course, right?). So early this morning I did. He just laid there and I said: “You too tired (you wanna-ha)”. He said, “kinda”. So nothing happened and I had to get up and put my clothes back on-awkward, or should I say, uncomfortable! I almost laughed out loud when it hit me that I had just experienced the chapter I just finished reading. We have been married for 22 years and I have to say sex has gotten a lot more intense the last 5 years. I feel like we feel (from lack of education and groups like these) that we can only have sex a certain way. It has to be “safe”. So I’m looking forward to learning more (and boy do I need to) and having some freaky great sex!!!
Not sure if that last statement reads right-groups like these HELP us get out of our comfort zone, learn, and have better sex.
I, for one, LOVED this chapter (shocker, right?)!!!! I too was in a terribly unfulfilling sexual relationship in my first marriage. We rarely had sex…maybe once a month…and went an entire 15 months without having sex. Now, I am with a partner that LOVES to please…and I wouldn’t trade it for anything. I also love to please him.
1. Who usually initiates sex and how? Next time what I want to happen is…….
It is pretty even. I initiate sex a lot more now than I used to. Most of the time, I’ll send texts throughout the day telling him what I want to do to him or what I want him to do to me. Once the kids are in bed, we look at each other and know what’s coming next. The most creative way I initiated sex was by spending 20 minutes at about 9:30PM doing my hair and makeup and then texting him to come into the bedroom. When he did, I tied him to a chair and gave him a lap dance that progressed into other things. He STILL talks about that night.
2. What do you think about the statement: “great sex is supposed to be uncomfortable. What are some areas of your sex life that you need to take a risk?
I am already a pretty big risk taker. There isn’t a whole lot that is off limits in our sex life and we communicate about everything..what we like, what we don’t, what we want to try, etc.
3. Are there some habits you would like to get rid of?
Not really. We tend to end up in the same position, but that’s because it is what feels great for both of us.
4. What are some of the biggest issues in your sex life? How have you tried to work on those or have you tried to talk to your partner about them?
Our biggest issue has been him holding back and then not being able to finish. I know it isn’t me…and that he feels really good, but I can’t help but doubt what I did and didn’t do. We talk about them when they happen and I try my hardest not to make him feel bad about it because he beats himself up like crazy. Communication is key…and it doesn’t stop when the lights go out.
Great ideas!
Luckily we haven’t really had problems in this area either. We are both really comfortable around each other and our marriage is a safe place where we can discuss what we really want, like and need without fear of being judged or humiliated. I stopped taking the birth control pill in April because I’m trying to eliminate chemicals from my life as much as possible and I felt like the pill was really messing with my body. We are using the Fertility Awareness Method now and I was afraid that this might put a damper on our sex life, but if anything it has made things even better! We’ve been reallllllly careful and haven’t had what I consider “actual” sex since I went off the pill. But we still make sure we are both “taken care of” and get creative in satisfying those needs. I’m happy to say that this cycle is the milestone we were waiting for so we can go back to having real sex this month!! Anyway,
1. Who usually initiates sex and how? Next time what I want to happen is…….
I have to say he probably initiates more than I do, but only by a little bit. I try to make it a rule that I will never turn him down when he initiates, even if I’m tired or not in the mood. I do, however, have a bad habit of pushing him away if he tries initiating while I’m in the middle of something and then going back to him when I’m done. I need to work on dropping everything and making him know that my door is always open for him, so to speak, no matter what I’m doing at the time. I want to make him feel special and loved that way, not like it’s a chore on my to do list that I’ll get around to eventually. So my goal is to not push him away for later but to embrace him with open arms when he comes to me.
2. What do you think about the statement: “great sex is supposed to be uncomfortable. What are some areas of your sex life that you need to take a risk?
I’m with Heather on this one. I am a risk taker too and we have definitely had some uncomfortable (in a good way!) sex before. It really is the best kind.
3. Are there some habits you would like to get rid of?
I guess I already addressed this question in my answer to number 1.
4. What are some of the biggest issues in your sex life? How have you tried to work on those or have you tried to talk to your partner about them?
The biggest issue is that I have IBS but I try to keep it under control through diet and exercise, and for the most part I don’t have any major problems anymore. It has affected our sex life in the past though and I don’t want to let it have that kind of power over me. Sometimes it just makes me feel gross and other times it’s just too painful to have sex. But again, I always make sure that he is at least taken care of under those circumstances.
This is great! I need to work on not pushing him away also! For me, it has to do with HOW he approaches me. I don’t like groping-I like a nice, long kiss!
So much to say, I’m not sure I have time for it all tonight!
I definitely need to work as well at not pushing him away. For a month or 6 weeks last year I made a rule with myself I would not turn him down. I don’t know why I stopped that. It really was a good thing.
I push him away WAY too often. Michele- I’m with you, I HATE groping, and I’m pretty sure I got a little ticked just reading the section about the reach over to the other side of the bed. That is the ONLY way he initiates. I have felt for a long time that the only time he reaches out to me physically (and not just in bed!) is when he want some later that night. So, over the years I’ve begun to push him away even more I think…holding hands, kissing, because I start to feel like it’s only for one reason.
I never imagined this is how I would be. I always felt like I was a cuddler, someone who craved that physical (non-sexual) connection. I don’t know if I’ve changed, or if I’ve just pushed it away. Kinda goes back to things I shared earlier on in this book: when you have such limited time together that you don’t even get to talk it’s hard for me to get to a place where I’m ready to give of myself physically. And yet, I need it.
When we do have sex it is honestly great, and even if I’m “not in the mood” he definitely knows how to get me there. 🙂 And he is much better about being “giving” in bed as well than I am.
So there you have it. I feel like I am spending my week opening up in different areas on different subjects to different people and becoming more vulnerable. I know it’s a good thing. I’ve been kind of shut down for awhile, and it’s time to be my real self again. But whew, this is an emotional week!
Cori I so understand what you are saying. One thing I started doing was putting my bitterness aside and reaching out more to him. Texting, dating diva date ideas, etc… I was amazed at how much HE changed when I started doing this. I also started not talking “business” (kids, finances, etc..) as much when he gets home. With men, it does seem like the only touch when they want something. I try to tell myself that at least he wants it and use the ASR to explain to him how I feel about initiating sex. I have a saying “I’m up here (pointing to my lips)…not here (pointing to my boobs)” LOL I do like that of course after we get started the right way. I’m going to use the never turn him away rule for a while and see what happens.
This is great @coridiane. Isn’t it nice to have a group of women with similar experiences here to share with and never be judged.
Have so much to say here! I felt like that too @Cori. Especially when my second was born, he joined the fire dept, we lost our house, moved next door to my in laws, and all my hair even started to fall out. We were so stressed. I was so exhausted. Only running a few hours of sleep at a time. and a super colicky newborn and a 18 month old who w also attached to my side. We hadn’t done it in a long time and it was becoming normal. ike twice a month. if htat. so not cool. He would literally be shaking when he ould even touch me to say hello. I felt like all he wanted was to do me. and all I wanted was a massage. That I so desperately needed. My muscles hurt so badly, I can remember. oh wait like they do now. Hahahha, dang kids. 😉 Anyway, I ha a friend tell me Ihat to stop wth holding. Iwas like, what?? I physically can’t do anymore than I already do. But the truth was I needed to make it a priority. Because I had been with holding for so long, he literally couldn’t handle being around me. I would get so mad, even just seeing me, he’d explode about something else and we’d fight. Both of us even more tired and frustrated than before. It got so bad stopped talking. I felt like all he needed was a hooker and a maid, and he’d be happy. That was a lie I kept feeding myself and torturing myself with. Like aren’t we supposed to punish our guys by not doing it with them? That s what I grew up watching on TV and heard from my older co workers. SOOOOO They only thing I could do was go for the gold. I had to do him so much that he’d never want it again! BWhaha. But it didn’t work like that. Now I understand he does need sex. just like food. and he can’t help if he is starving, right. Me neither, except I didn’t know I was starving mysef too. I you think about it as the one way they can communicate their love and need for a real connection to us, it makes it easier on me.
I am waiting on the book to arrive…I finally ordered it! I’ll take your advice, Lori, and will not start with this chapter. In fact, I would like to read them all. Hopefully, the book will arrive in time to get some chapters under my belt and I can participate on Tuesday. 🙂
Humm…you should have gotten it by now. Let me know if you don’t get it at least by tomorrow!
I was in a relationship for close to 14 years, had two children with him and not one single orgasm. I figured it was my problem because I had issues. Now I know the problems were much more than my physical problems I had back then and even more than just the relationship issues.
I know we’ve had issues and are still working on learning about each other, but with my ff, I’ve been blessed with a man who makes me melt just talking to me but does way more when we get the chance.
1. Who usually initiates sex and how? *grin* We both are pretty open about when and what we want with each other. It’s not too hard to tell when one or the other is thinking of sex.
Next time… I might make him wait a bit just to make it better. 🙂
2. What do you think about the statement: “great sex is supposed to be uncomfortable. What are some areas of your sex life that you need to take a risk?
I actually understand and agree with this. Sex gets boring if you do the same thing over and over and don’t change things and explore each other. I’ve never been with anyone before who made me as willing to learn and enjoy what makes both of us fulfilled regarding sex.
I had a friend with benefits after my kids dad who taught me that yes, sex can be fun. I also learned that it quickly got boring when you did the same thing each time and if you didn’t connect much regarding other parts of life. We are still friends and supportive of each other regarding family and work issues, but the spark for more was just not there.
3. Are there some habits you would like to get rid of? Apologizing for changes in my body.. I know he finds me sexy and he makes darn certain I know it. I’m self conscious because when I get stressed or I’ve been sick I either lose weight or quit working out as much as I used to. The changes are negative to me, but he doesn’t see them.
4. What are some of the biggest issues in your sex life? My fear of rejection and not knowing how to communicate well.
How have you tried to work on those or have you tried to talk to your partner about them? My ff has been wonderful about this part and has gotten to where he insists that I tell him what I want him to do.. almost specifically in order to push me out of my comfort zone. I think it’s his way of pushing control back to me but still letting him have control if that makes sense?
I think I surprised him the other day.. he was like..”If you aren’t talking I’m going to stop” So I responded.. “ok.. My turn” and the look he gave me was all fire.. *wicked grin*